there's every reason to believe this is happening again with the NSA
No, there isn't -- there is no such evidence that our elected officials are being coerced by the NSA.
Let me say it again, if such proof is revealed then it would be absolutely terrifying for everybody involved and all over the news (be it MSM or social or whatever). As it stands now there are only claims, and there is a distinct lack of evidence and facts surrounding such claims.
Now, with regards to blackmailing our elected officials, I think we can put it simply as such: the fear of just the possibility that we might be blackmailed is enough to cause self-censorship. This is a historical truth and accepted as self-evident.
That said, our elected officials are no less victims than we are. They are spied on as much as -- if not more than -- us.
Please acknowledge this one thing, if you will acknowledge anything in my post: our elected officials are no less victims than we are.
Please acknowledge this one thing, if you will acknowledge anything in my post: our elected officials are no less victims than we are.
If I hire someone to walk around a room punching everyone in the face, my nose may be broken, but I'm not a victim in any real sense. These officials made their choice and it came back to bite them in the ass.
The OP knows there is no evidence, hence the use of the phrase "every reason to believe". It is believed to be true using reason, not evidence. Its a best deduction.
Your demand for evidence and facts is bogus, since there cant really be any. What we are talking about is what goes on in the mind of an individual. We cant prove that. But we do know that, for want of a better term, implied pressure to conform works. Its the same reason belief in a god works. God knows all and will punish us if we don't follow his rules. So, if we believe in the god/NSA, we do what is wanted because we don't want to be punished.
We know people act like this. We know it is possible that the NSA has information that might damage us, or ones we love. We know what the NSA wants. Therefor we have reason to believe someone who might want to control the NSA won't out of personal fear.
A reasonable deduction, based on what is known and history. No, sorry, no evidence. That one of the nice things about blackmail, there usually isn't because the victim obviously doesn't want to be outed.
Yes, of course the elected officials are victims in this, potentially. But as elected officials, with the power of democracy, they are, IMHO, duty bound to put that aside. Not doing so is selfish cowardice. Some one has to be as brave as Snowden, and I don't see that in our elected officials.
I find it amusing that you are being downvoted, because you are absolutely correct.
In light of what we do know about the NSA, it is completely reasonable to assume (and in fact believe) the worst when we speculate on what we don't know. If people ask, "what evidence do you have?" I just respond with, "I'm sorry, but have you actually been paying any attention to Snowden's revelations and have you done any critical thinking about what they actually mean?" That is enough to shut them up.
Power corrupts, and absolute power corrupts absolutely. And the NSA has as close to absolute power as one can reasonably reach today: in the Age of Information, they have access to almost all information. What makes them especially dangerous is that their deeds are powered by their misguided conscience. They strongly believe that what they are doing is the Right Thing because it protects America. People who have succumbed to such fundamentalist thinking will do anything with the power they have, including blackmailing politicians.
Just because someone or some organization is really really bad does not mean that all critical thinking ceases and every contrived scenario becomes true.
Right... just because an organization has been caught doing things in the past, and lying about them, doesn't mean they'll continue to do those things, and lie about them... especially now that those things have become too easy to do, and therefore probably too boring to bother with.
The NSA has likely already used its capabilities for blackmail, but it's impossible to confirm because they would never directly blackmail someone, as in "do this or else", because that would be easily traceable to them and cause a PR nightmare.
Instead, people who run afoul of their agenda will have damaging information leaked through seemingly unrelated channels, or be targeted by other law enforcement agencies after parallel construction tip-offs.
This instills more fear and creates stronger influence than the threat of direct blackmail. Rather than being faced with explicit demands, anyone in power with something to hide must continually assess whether anything they say or do could be construed as offensive to the intelligence community.
Comments
No, there isn't -- there is no such evidence that our elected officials are being coerced by the NSA.
Let me say it again, if such proof is revealed then it would be absolutely terrifying for everybody involved and all over the news (be it MSM or social or whatever). As it stands now there are only claims, and there is a distinct lack of evidence and facts surrounding such claims.
Now, with regards to blackmailing our elected officials, I think we can put it simply as such: the fear of just the possibility that we might be blackmailed is enough to cause self-censorship. This is a historical truth and accepted as self-evident.
That said, our elected officials are no less victims than we are. They are spied on as much as -- if not more than -- us.
Please acknowledge this one thing, if you will acknowledge anything in my post: our elected officials are no less victims than we are.
If I hire someone to walk around a room punching everyone in the face, my nose may be broken, but I'm not a victim in any real sense. These officials made their choice and it came back to bite them in the ass.
ihsw meant the other elected officials.
The OP knows there is no evidence, hence the use of the phrase "every reason to believe". It is believed to be true using reason, not evidence. Its a best deduction.
Your demand for evidence and facts is bogus, since there cant really be any. What we are talking about is what goes on in the mind of an individual. We cant prove that. But we do know that, for want of a better term, implied pressure to conform works. Its the same reason belief in a god works. God knows all and will punish us if we don't follow his rules. So, if we believe in the god/NSA, we do what is wanted because we don't want to be punished.
We know people act like this. We know it is possible that the NSA has information that might damage us, or ones we love. We know what the NSA wants. Therefor we have reason to believe someone who might want to control the NSA won't out of personal fear.
A reasonable deduction, based on what is known and history. No, sorry, no evidence. That one of the nice things about blackmail, there usually isn't because the victim obviously doesn't want to be outed.
Yes, of course the elected officials are victims in this, potentially. But as elected officials, with the power of democracy, they are, IMHO, duty bound to put that aside. Not doing so is selfish cowardice. Some one has to be as brave as Snowden, and I don't see that in our elected officials.
I find it amusing that you are being downvoted, because you are absolutely correct.
In light of what we do know about the NSA, it is completely reasonable to assume (and in fact believe) the worst when we speculate on what we don't know. If people ask, "what evidence do you have?" I just respond with, "I'm sorry, but have you actually been paying any attention to Snowden's revelations and have you done any critical thinking about what they actually mean?" That is enough to shut them up.
Power corrupts, and absolute power corrupts absolutely. And the NSA has as close to absolute power as one can reasonably reach today: in the Age of Information, they have access to almost all information. What makes them especially dangerous is that their deeds are powered by their misguided conscience. They strongly believe that what they are doing is the Right Thing because it protects America. People who have succumbed to such fundamentalist thinking will do anything with the power they have, including blackmailing politicians.
Just because someone or some organization is really really bad does not mean that all critical thinking ceases and every contrived scenario becomes true.
Down that path lays dragons and madness.
Right... just because an organization has been caught doing things in the past, and lying about them, doesn't mean they'll continue to do those things, and lie about them... especially now that those things have become too easy to do, and therefore probably too boring to bother with.
So all critical thinking stops and we assume they do anything and everything any person ever may accuse them of.
How logical and reasonable. /s
The NSA has likely already used its capabilities for blackmail, but it's impossible to confirm because they would never directly blackmail someone, as in "do this or else", because that would be easily traceable to them and cause a PR nightmare.
Instead, people who run afoul of their agenda will have damaging information leaked through seemingly unrelated channels, or be targeted by other law enforcement agencies after parallel construction tip-offs.
This instills more fear and creates stronger influence than the threat of direct blackmail. Rather than being faced with explicit demands, anyone in power with something to hide must continually assess whether anything they say or do could be construed as offensive to the intelligence community.