I agree that it's ultimately a policy issue that needs to be mended by congress, what I disagree with is the needless "dig" at companies that store and analyze large amounts of data, as if that somehow is invalid conduct. The problem is the government demanding access to that data, not that the data is there in the first place.
...what I disagree with is the needless "dig" at companies that store and analyze large amounts of data, as if that somehow is invalid conduct.
The argument against building systems to amass huge databases of personal information has always been that the very existence of such systems would almost inevitably lead to abuse, through inappropriate expansion of the collection activity and through inappropriate uses of the resulting database. It's simply too tempting a target to leave unmolested.
From that point of view, storing and analyzing large amounts of data is "invalid conduct."
Current events are just history proving this out yet again.
Arguably the collection of large amounts of private data is a fundamental property of the internet and impossible to avoid. In a world of government back doors into hardware and software the difference between cloud and local is an increasingly mute point for most people; making privacy a technical improbability. If any connected device can be accessed how can invalid conduct ever be avoided?
The fundamental property of the internet is connection. Everything else is in how we use it.
The fundamental property of land is spatial relation. Using that, you can build a town of little houses, where everybody has a modest and equal helping of privacy. You can build a giant open agora, where everybody can see everybody's business. Or you can build a panoptic prison: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Panopticon
That is an extreme point of view that I don't agree with. I'd like to point out that these abuses weren't committed by the data holders but by the government, the same entity tasked with regulating data abuse, also as long as the user has control over their data and the ability to opt out, much of the potential threat is neutralized.
That is an extreme point of view that I don't agree with.
That's your prerogative, of course, but we're talking about the past now. It's not theoretical anymore. It has really happened, it is really happening.
I'd like to point out that theses abuses weren't done by the data holders but by the government...
You are drawing a sharp line between private enterprise and the government, but it seems like an increasingly irrelevant, imaginary distinction.
From a practical point of view, for the average user on the modern web, there never was such a distinction worth making, as it turns out. The "data holders" will rat you out to the government and the government will give orders to the "data holders" that they simply have to comply with. In many respects, the "data holders" may as well be another government office, from a privacy-minded point of view.
Wait, why is it better for part X rather than party Y? both are likely to abuse the data, absent non-naive controls or incentive structures. 'take my word' or 'trust me' etc are not such structures AFAIK.
These companies can't detain you in an airport or throw you in prison, there are massive benefits to be had from this data for the user, not to mention that you have a contract in place with these companies that don't have with the NSA.
Cops searched this family's house at a private corporation's behest, more or less. The fact that a large database is privately held isn't going to protect you from the government.
Her employer tipped off the FBI after seeing suspicious searches show up in their logs. Not Google.
Yes, that's what I said in my comment, that's what it says in the link you just posted, that's what it says in the link I posted, and that is the story you are telling me now as some sort of correction.
It's not hysteria to say that they got their house searched as a result of a Google search, or as the ultimate result of the actions of a private corporation; those are facts we apparently agree on, facts that every single media report on the incident agreed on, AFAIK. Its the consensus view.
Comments
I agree that it's ultimately a policy issue that needs to be mended by congress, what I disagree with is the needless "dig" at companies that store and analyze large amounts of data, as if that somehow is invalid conduct. The problem is the government demanding access to that data, not that the data is there in the first place.
...what I disagree with is the needless "dig" at companies that store and analyze large amounts of data, as if that somehow is invalid conduct.
The argument against building systems to amass huge databases of personal information has always been that the very existence of such systems would almost inevitably lead to abuse, through inappropriate expansion of the collection activity and through inappropriate uses of the resulting database. It's simply too tempting a target to leave unmolested.
From that point of view, storing and analyzing large amounts of data is "invalid conduct."
Current events are just history proving this out yet again.
Arguably the collection of large amounts of private data is a fundamental property of the internet and impossible to avoid. In a world of government back doors into hardware and software the difference between cloud and local is an increasingly mute point for most people; making privacy a technical improbability. If any connected device can be accessed how can invalid conduct ever be avoided?
The fundamental property of the internet is connection. Everything else is in how we use it.
The fundamental property of land is spatial relation. Using that, you can build a town of little houses, where everybody has a modest and equal helping of privacy. You can build a giant open agora, where everybody can see everybody's business. Or you can build a panoptic prison: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Panopticon
That is an extreme point of view that I don't agree with. I'd like to point out that these abuses weren't committed by the data holders but by the government, the same entity tasked with regulating data abuse, also as long as the user has control over their data and the ability to opt out, much of the potential threat is neutralized.
That is an extreme point of view that I don't agree with.
That's your prerogative, of course, but we're talking about the past now. It's not theoretical anymore. It has really happened, it is really happening.
I'd like to point out that theses abuses weren't done by the data holders but by the government...
You are drawing a sharp line between private enterprise and the government, but it seems like an increasingly irrelevant, imaginary distinction.
From a practical point of view, for the average user on the modern web, there never was such a distinction worth making, as it turns out. The "data holders" will rat you out to the government and the government will give orders to the "data holders" that they simply have to comply with. In many respects, the "data holders" may as well be another government office, from a privacy-minded point of view.
Wait, why is it better for part X rather than party Y? both are likely to abuse the data, absent non-naive controls or incentive structures. 'take my word' or 'trust me' etc are not such structures AFAIK.
These companies can't detain you in an airport or throw you in prison, there are massive benefits to be had from this data for the user, not to mention that you have a contract in place with these companies that don't have with the NSA.
These companies can't detain you in an airport or throw you in prison...
Neither can the NSA.
Remember this? (http://www.theatlanticwire.com/national/2013/08/government-k...)
Cops searched this family's house at a private corporation's behest, more or less. The fact that a large database is privately held isn't going to protect you from the government.
Actually, that story was later proven to be false and hysterics drummed up by the woman who was searched.
Skip to the update: http://watchdog.org/98870/feds-raid-home-after-couple-search...
http://www.forbes.com/sites/kashmirhill/2013/08/01/employer-...
Her employer tipped off the FBI after seeing suspicious searches show up in their logs. Not Google.
Please check your facts and leave the tinfoil hat hysterics at the door.
I'm worried about what the NSA is doing too, but making shit up doesn't help.
Her employer tipped off the FBI after seeing suspicious searches show up in their logs. Not Google.
Yes, that's what I said in my comment, that's what it says in the link you just posted, that's what it says in the link I posted, and that is the story you are telling me now as some sort of correction.
It's not hysteria to say that they got their house searched as a result of a Google search, or as the ultimate result of the actions of a private corporation; those are facts we apparently agree on, facts that every single media report on the incident agreed on, AFAIK. Its the consensus view.
Weird, why were her husband and son using her work computer? Maybe she brought it home, and they used it, and her company monitored her in her home?
Other branches of government can, relying on NSA intelligence.
Just to be clear that example you offer is a case of an employer monitoring employee activity on company equipment, which is another can of worms: http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/2013/08/pressure-cooker/
Also it's not an account of action taken against consumers or users, nor is it any example of a "large database".
And, most importantly, you can leave.