The contract almost always states otherwise though. Unless maybe you're working in an area where the companies doesn't care about their IP or are just simply ignorant.
This is the other extreme - which I didnt mention in the op.
I agree that copying code is wrong - but what about a good idea that you come up with, or a neat design or technique in code?
It seems unfair given that doctors, scientists, marketing and many other professionals can keep a record of their work. Maybe not reams of data, but something. (I am not 100% sure of the extent they are allowed to). All art professionals have portfolios.
Is your brain just a vessel to be washed clean before it is rented out again?
Again, I am not talking of secret algorithms that would break a company, not someone else's work.
I can never really agree to such a clause, though. In the most extreme case it would mean I could never take on another contract, because I already used up all my programming tricks in the first one. For example I might have employed the MVC pattern, will I be able to ever use it again?
I've worked on over 20 software contracts and never once did the contract contain a clause that forced me to assign copyright agreement to the person paying for the software. Note that this only applies to contractors, not exempt employees.
Interesting...at the places I've worked (as an employee), it was considered a dealbreaker if a contractor wanted to own the source code they produced. We passed up some really, really good contractors because they wanted to own the product.
I'm not actually commenting on either A) or B), just on menloparkbum's comment that it's common for contractors to retain ownership.
I don't really want to get into the ethics of it, because I don't think ethical debates are particularly fruitful. (I took a course in meta-ethics in college, which makes me particularly suspicious in attempts to ground ethical judgments in factual statements or logical debate.) I'll tell you that I wouldn't do it; it sounds dodgy enough that I wouldn't really want to get involved with it. Ultimately, most ethical judgments come down to gut feelings about right or wrong.
I will say that right or wrong, I think it's stupid. You're opening yourself up to big legal liability. If acquirers or investors find out about it (and they will - that's what due diligence is for), they will nix the deal. Heck, I'm spending about $1K to have a lawyer draw up a release to make sure all IP I developed for my startup while employed belongs to me, and I didn't take any source code from my employer (I'm using a completely different technology platform and am in a completely different area of business.) It's just something I don't want to fuck around with.
Enterprise software? That surprises me based on my limited experiences, but all the better for you I imagine you own a sizable amount of useful code by now.
no problem. I've never worked on enterprise software. mostly weird, short term stuff for startups, researchers and artistes. the code was sometimes fun, but sadly, almost never useful outside of the specific contract.
Comments
The contract almost always states otherwise though. Unless maybe you're working in an area where the companies doesn't care about their IP or are just simply ignorant.
This is the other extreme - which I didnt mention in the op.
I agree that copying code is wrong - but what about a good idea that you come up with, or a neat design or technique in code?
It seems unfair given that doctors, scientists, marketing and many other professionals can keep a record of their work. Maybe not reams of data, but something. (I am not 100% sure of the extent they are allowed to). All art professionals have portfolios.
Is your brain just a vessel to be washed clean before it is rented out again?
Again, I am not talking of secret algorithms that would break a company, not someone else's work.
I can never really agree to such a clause, though. In the most extreme case it would mean I could never take on another contract, because I already used up all my programming tricks in the first one. For example I might have employed the MVC pattern, will I be able to ever use it again?
I've worked on over 20 software contracts and never once did the contract contain a clause that forced me to assign copyright agreement to the person paying for the software. Note that this only applies to contractors, not exempt employees.
http://www.developerdotstar.com/mag/articles/daniels_softwar...
Interesting...at the places I've worked (as an employee), it was considered a dealbreaker if a contractor wanted to own the source code they produced. We passed up some really, really good contractors because they wanted to own the product.
please also comment on A) since the person is likely to become an investor in my product in the near term.
I'm not actually commenting on either A) or B), just on menloparkbum's comment that it's common for contractors to retain ownership.
I don't really want to get into the ethics of it, because I don't think ethical debates are particularly fruitful. (I took a course in meta-ethics in college, which makes me particularly suspicious in attempts to ground ethical judgments in factual statements or logical debate.) I'll tell you that I wouldn't do it; it sounds dodgy enough that I wouldn't really want to get involved with it. Ultimately, most ethical judgments come down to gut feelings about right or wrong.
I will say that right or wrong, I think it's stupid. You're opening yourself up to big legal liability. If acquirers or investors find out about it (and they will - that's what due diligence is for), they will nix the deal. Heck, I'm spending about $1K to have a lawyer draw up a release to make sure all IP I developed for my startup while employed belongs to me, and I didn't take any source code from my employer (I'm using a completely different technology platform and am in a completely different area of business.) It's just something I don't want to fuck around with.
Enterprise software? That surprises me based on my limited experiences, but all the better for you I imagine you own a sizable amount of useful code by now.
Great article btw, thanks.
no problem. I've never worked on enterprise software. mostly weird, short term stuff for startups, researchers and artistes. the code was sometimes fun, but sadly, almost never useful outside of the specific contract.