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Comment on Ask HN: Should I teach my kids to type with QWERTY or Dvorak?

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Bear in mind there's no point switching to a Dvorak keyboard unless you also teach them to touch type. A touch typist on a regular keyboard is still going to be a lot faster than a non-touch typist on a Dvorak.

I'm confused--according to a quick search, "touch typing" is being able to type without looking at the keyboard?

Can you even say you know how to type if you have to look at the keys to do it?

I'm afraid this will be seen as a fairly arrogant stance. Plenty of people cannot type reasonably without looking at their keyboard once in a while, if only for the symbols. I know plenty of programmers who are productive enough, and can type letters and parentheses and so forth without looking away from the screen, but need to glance at the keyboard for the lesser-used symbols.

Those people definitely know how to type. In fact, they know how to type _far_ better than many of the people in this world who don't work with a computer 7 days per week >=8 hours per day.

If you watch most people typing they occasionally glance at the keyboard, especially for little-user keys. A true touch typist should be able to type for extended periods without looking at the keyboard at all even for only occasionally used keys. Also true touch typing minimises finger and hand movements by using as many of the fingers of the hand to type with as possible, while most keyboard users rely on a few, and often just two fingers for most or all typing.

Yes. Have a look at some professionals you interact with that you'd expect to type a lot. Real estate agents, doctors, bankers, etc. You don't have to look far to find someone who pecks with index fingers whole looking at the keyboard. They sure know how to type (they produce the text they intend to) and do a lot of it every day.

Seeing people hunt for keys with one or two index fingers - not when writing something profound, requiring of thought, but simply filling out forms - is incredibly frustrating. I'm going to argue they can't type when they're still using the keyboard as if it's the first day they saw one.

A day or two spent learning to type would pay itself back with dividends.

I put in the ground work for touch typing at school on the good old typewriters; it was certainly the best extra curriculum subject I've ever done.

I'm going to argue they can't type

They push the buttons and letters appear on screen. That's typing - everything else is optimisation :P

I've seen plenty of people in the middle that didn't get formal training, but instead developed patterns based around clusters of keys. They may use more than two fingers, but they have no concept of the home row. In fact, I've been asked by people who type fairly often what the little bumps on the 'f' and 'j' keys are, which tells me that they most likely didn't learn to type properly.

My 5yo can "type" by hunting and pecking, and he's actually getting good enough that he doesn't get frustrated trying to type simple words (he likes looking up words at the library computers). My 2yo, however, knows his letters, but I don't think he really understands how keyboards work.

Personally, I'd say that someone can type if they can use a keyboard productively and have some means of speeding up entry besides looking at every key until they find the one they want (most people know vaguely where there keys are, even if they can't touch type).

If you are not at a keyboard often a few days spent learning to touch type is wasted: your brain will quickly forget and you are back to looking. You need to practice ANYTHING to retain the ability to do it (some things are easier than others which is why you can ride a bike after years of not touching one).

If you are going to use a keyboard often, then the time spent to learn a keyboard is well worth it. However if your day job doesn't require a keyboard those classes won't be helpful.

Some people do claim that, yeah.

But I'd say there is actually a level between non-typist and touch-typist where the person needs to be looking at the keyboard, but knows where each key is and reaches that direction without actually having to move their eyes. They're really close to being a touch-typist, but they still need their eyes to get their fingers on the buttons reliably.

I'd argue that Qwerty vs Dvorak relies on that intermediary step rather than actual "touch typing", but there isn't really a name for it.

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